Is Gimp a good utility for skinning?

Aviar · July 09, 2009, 07:46:41 AM

Howdy. I'm always asking people to alter skins for me, so I decided to try and do some myself. I heard about Gimp and because it's free, that's what I decided to use.

I know nothing about skinning, but I would like to try simple things like add/erase numbers, add some nose art, things like that. I know that to be a real skinner can take a very long time. I'll never be able to do that, but I might be able to master some of the simple tasks.

However, after spending several hours with Gimp, I don't feel like I learned anything about skinning at all.

For instance, how hard is it to simply erase a number on an aircraft? Is it always the same procedure, or does it depend on how the skin was created? Does it matter what program the original skin was created with?

I even watched some Gimp tutorials on YouTube concerning the cloning tool. I was able to do it, but the final product looked horrible.

I thought you skinners used multiple layers, but every skin I loaded into Gimp only had one layer. I must be doing something wrong. I was hoping that the numbers were on one layer, and that I could just delete that layer. Maybe Gimp cannot see multiple layers? I know the program is free, so maybe it's not that powerful?

I really have no clue what I'm talking about here......I'm totally lost. After all these hours, I've gotten nowhere.

Aviar

_AH_Stiffy · July 09, 2009, 09:44:41 AM

ive never used gimp so i cant comment on it, but with that said, i can comment on some of your other question.
layers, yes the use of layers is the way to go. try downloading a template and looking at that to see how many layers they use and what types of things are on them.
Clone tool, dont know what to add to this except it takes practice, trial+error ect.

once your done with your image, you have to merge the layers together which is why when you open a skin up all you see is one layer

your best bet is to have someone walk you thru the basics so you get a feel for it and then try the tutorals again, things will work out better for you

good luck

ps. i use paint shop pro 7

_AH_DarkWolf · July 09, 2009, 08:46:43 PM

Stiffy is correct (for a Red Wings fan), modifying an existing skin is difficult. Paticularly removing things since you might have to re-draw details. Little easier to add things, but you won't have the details of rivets, panel lines and weathering over what you add unless you try and draw the stuff in by hand. You could try putting the skin you want to modify as the base layer in a template, that way you'd have some detail over the stuff you add, might help some if your're removing stuff too. But that can result in excessive weathering and details on the rest of the skin.

Working from a template is a little harder, but you'll get better results. Depending on what a/c you want to paint, there are some killer templates out there that require very little work to create a nice skin. Others are a royal pain in the @$$. You should take a look at a few templates, you might find it easier than you think.

DW

Aviar · July 09, 2009, 10:39:52 PM

I think I'll stick to mission-building and let the experts do the skinning. What was I thinking?

Aviar

_AH_Gonzo · July 09, 2009, 10:45:17 PM

S! Aviar, don't give up on it. Skinning can be fun. It takes a while to get the hang of it and you'll always be learning new things but the results can be awesome.

_AH_DarkWolf · July 09, 2009, 11:09:32 PM

Yeah, if you've got the patience for mission building, skinning from templates should'nt be a stretch.

DW

_AH_Col._Hogan · July 10, 2009, 12:18:40 AM

I use the 64 count of Crayola Crayons

S!

Aviar · July 10, 2009, 05:09:43 AM

It looks like MS Paint is about as complicated as I can handle. As Dirty Harry said...."A man's gotta know his limitations."

Aviar

_AH_Twisted · July 10, 2009, 05:53:46 PM

Aviar the hardest part about skinning is getting used to what ever program you decide to use. Knowing how to use what .

Personally I'm at a slight disadvantage over many of the other skinners like DW because quite frankly my pc is so out of date. Considering I built this back in 2001 so I can't turn the graphics up in game high enough to see how the skin would look like to others that are able to so I guess a lot in hopes it does look good (kooky).

To me mission building is WAY harder than skinning. I've tried but can't figure it out very well yet. At least compared to what others build. I just like working with graphics so it is more natural for me.

I started out by just laying complete color coverage over the void skins then changing certain areas, launch the game and see what changed where. It was all trial and error. Now there are some really good templates you can download to work with. Also a lot of other skins to see what panels are where.

By the way I use Paintshop Pro 6 and 10 combined. Because I do I've got to also use a program called Bright to compress and change the color depth back to 256 without much bleeding and color loss.
~S~

_AH_Col._Hogan · July 10, 2009, 06:26:35 PM

I know, lets trade skins for Av's coop folder (glasses)

Aviar · July 11, 2009, 04:38:20 AM

I've hung up my paintbrush....back to the FMB. I'm working on a coop mission for the AH squad.

It's a high altitude B-29 strike into North Korea, escorted by F-86's and intercepted by MiG'15's. The F-86's will take off from two different airfields and need to rendezvous with the already airborn B-29's. The MiG-15's will scramble from two airfields and be vectored to intercept the bombers.

The MiG-15 was originally intended to intercept American bombers like the B-29. F-86 squadrons were rushed to the Far East in late 1950, as an answer to the newly-introduced MiG-15.

As soon as the 'official' F-86 and MiG-15 are released, I'll send the mission to the AH squad. Thanks for everything!

Aviar

_AH_Duff4r · July 11, 2009, 05:36:34 AM

For simple stuff like changing numbers, names, etc. I use Paint.net.

It's MS paint on serious steroids and free! Here: http://www.getpaint.net

Aviar · July 11, 2009, 09:25:27 AM

Quote from: _AH_Duff4r on July 11, 2009, 05:36:34 AM
For simple stuff like changing numbers, names, etc. I use Paint.net.

It's MS paint on serious steroids and free! Here: http://www.getpaint.net

As Michael Corleone said...."Just when I thought I was out... they pull me back in."

Ok, I downloaded Paint.NET and I actually liked some things better than Gimp, although it has less features.

But one thing has me stumped.....the numbering on both sides of the fuselage. One side is no problem. The other side has to be somehow flipped.......upside down and backwards (I think).

Anyway, I can't do it....LOL. No clue. The Font Tool has no option to do this. Now, I figured out that I could 'Flip Vertical' the entire skin and then I could get the 'upside down' part.......but no clue on how to get the numbers on that side BACKWARDS.

Now, if you even understood what I just said, you may have more problems than I do.

Aviar

Aviar · July 11, 2009, 09:41:19 AM

Oh for cryin' outloud....I think I figured it out. You also have to flip the entire skin Horizontal before you apply the number on the other side. And then (I learned the hard way) you also have to flip everything back to the way it was.....or else your plane will not look like a plane.....holy mother of pearl.

Man, skinning is sooooo much harder than mission-building.....and I'm not even skinning...LOL. I'm playing with little numbers on a cartoon plane at 05:30.

I'm going to sleep....but I finally erased and changed my first set of numbers on a plane!

Aviar

_AH_Col._Hogan · July 11, 2009, 05:05:55 PM

I think I smell an Intervention.......

S!

_AH_Stiffy · July 11, 2009, 10:43:48 PM

you just need someone to walk you thru some steps

one tip, if you add the numbers to a layer and not the skin itself, you can flip that layer and move it
to where you want it

heck i had BBQ adding nose art after 4 hours.......(he was being difficult)
usually only takes about 30 mins to an hour to get up and running doing basic stuff

Aviar · July 11, 2009, 11:09:41 PM

Thanks Stiffy, but I guess you didn't read all of my posts. I already figured out how to erase and add new numbers.

Ok, now there is something I really want to learn. How can I apply a noseart onto a skin? I don't like how the in-game noseart looks....kind of like a decal.

I want to place custom noseart right on the skin, like you guys have. I guess it's some kind of cut and paste, but I tried that and didn't even come close.

I'm gonna need some real help with this one. I don't think I can figure this one out on my own. Even the guy who helps me with some of my skins doesn't know how to do it.

Aviar

_AH_Stiffy · July 12, 2009, 09:37:24 AM

Well, I did real all your posts, i just never had to flip the whole skin over and back or whatever it is your doing to get it to work. bottom line, if you found a way to make it work, then do it.

as far as adding nose art to the skin, i think your wanting the rivits and lines to show on it
i could tell you how i do it but its paintshop pro so i think it would make you more lost then before

Aviar · July 12, 2009, 05:15:34 PM

Thanks for your offer. However, since I'm working with Gimp, that's what I need help with.

Aviar

_AH_Col._Hogan · July 12, 2009, 07:05:32 PM

Is it ironic that the program you are struggling with is called "Gimp"? or would that be a coincidence?

S!

Aviar · July 12, 2009, 10:59:50 PM

Quote from: _AH_Col._Hogan on July 12, 2009, 07:05:32 PM
Is it ironic that the program you are struggling with is called "Gimp"? or would that be a coincidence?

S!

There must be some reason I'm drawn to it.

*I'm actually getting closer though. Somehow, I actually got the noseart on the plane. However, I can't get the background transparent. So, I have a big gray rectangle with a pretty girl inside of it. I've tried so many things, but I can't get that gray to be transparent.

Aviar

_AH_Twisted · July 12, 2009, 11:21:13 PM

When you convert it over to a bmp any transparent areas turn white, so don't fret.

Aviar · July 13, 2009, 01:22:19 AM

Quote from: _AH_Twisted on July 12, 2009, 11:21:13 PM
When you convert it over to a bmp any transparent areas turn white, so don't fret.

Maybe I didn't explain it well. I already converted it to a BMP file and flown the plane in IL-2. (you don't even need to fly the plane. You can see if the background is transparent as soon as you place the art onto the skin.)

The noseart is on the plane, but the background of the rectangle is not transparent, like it should be. In this case, it's the color gray.

I don't know how to manipulate Gimp to make the background transparent.

Aviar

_AH_Stiffy · July 13, 2009, 02:50:23 AM

try this,

add a transparent layer to the skin, add the nose art to the invisible layter then erase the gray part

Aviar · July 13, 2009, 03:16:22 AM

Somehow, I actually did it! I don't know if I can ever do it again, because I was just trying different things until it worked.

The noseart now is much more pixelated than the in-game noseart, but it doesn't have that 'decal' look. I'll have to see if there is a way to attach the artwork without so much pixelation.

Aviar